Landing a Lawyer Client by Being Lazy?

[Dexx]

Hey gang,

Figured I'd post something I experience last week, but didn't think to post it until it came up in conversation while I was talking on the phone with Maria Gudelis about it yesterday.

So I was at a local law firm's office getting my documents notarized for Amazon.com so I could get an Individual Tax Identification Number (ITIN), for IRS and tax purposes, for when I start selling my "Amazon System"-style books on there.

Not thinking much of what I had to get done that day, I just dressed in jeans and hoodie (since I had to take my daughter to daycare first) and showed up at the law office for my scheduled time.

So everything's going along, documents are being reviewed etc. and the lawyer eventually asks what I'm doing with Amazon that I needed an ITIN number for...

I simply said (not thinking anything of it) that I recently wrote a book on Small Business Marketing tips, and Amazon was going to be publishing it for me.

Well let me tell you...the lawyer's eyes widened and he says:

"Small Business Marketing tips?! We could probably use some of that information! We have no idea really how to market the firm outside of the traditional marketing like Yellow Pages and stuff. We had some golf balls and towels made up for a golf tournament last spring and that was about it."

Guys...this led to a 30 minute conversation (on the lawyer's dime) of me asking him questions like "did you track the leads generated from the golf merchandise?" (answer was no.)

"Do you track your advertising results from the Yellow Pages right now?" (answer was they had actually decided to cancel the YP ads because they felt it was a waste of money with no results)

Then he went on to say how they had updated the website but he hadn't checked it in a while...I asked him how long ago the update was and he said it was a couple years ago.

Then HE says to me "I'd like it if you could come back and give us a copy of your book!"

-> Keep in mind I was in JEANS and a HOODIE <-

Did I feel underdressed? Hell ya...did that end up mattering...not in the end!

I never even thought it was going to be worth while approaching law firms since they get hassled by solicitors all the time, yet when the topic of what I did came up naturally in conversation the lawyer sold himself on my needs.

Moral of the story: If you aren't even MENTIONING what you do to businesses then you are denying them your help. You don't need to run around selling them, and harassing them cold calling...but instead just get into conversations with business owners as you deal with them (shopping etc.) and let things go from there.

Now this doesn't mean "for sure" I'll end up having this lawyer as a client, but it didn't cost me anything if I don't...plus I'll give him a copy of my book with a handwritten note and business card stapled inside...if he says "No" now...he might be saying "We need you" later...

Though I'm pretty confident I'll be booking an interview meeting with him

Cheers,

~Dexx

[Tanner]

Nice Dexx! Thats a lot how I felt when I sold my investment broker on the $5k book deal. It was the last thing on my mind.

...It seems that these are the times when your best prospects appear. And it plays to the saying "always be ready".

[L.James]

Interesting story Dexx, hopefully I'll have similar stories in the near future.

[MrPhelps]

Perhaps the moral of the story is to "dress down" when visiting these guys.

I had a client years ago and one time I went to a project meeting in a different office than usual. There as a guy at the table who looked like some bum they'd drug in from the park. He had a 5-day beard, was totally unkept, and never said a word; in fact, he looked like he wasn't even paying attention. He was never introduced to me, and afterwards I asked my client who he was. "Oh, he's Skip's dad. He owns the place we were in. In fact, he's the guy who bought up the rest of our shares. He has Skip deal with us, but he likes to drop in on meetings now and then." I said, "Does he always show up looking like that?" "Yup. He owns the place, and they pull in ten mil a year, so I guess he feels he's earned the right."

Richard Branson doesn't exactly dress like someone you'd think would be worth listening to, either.

-David

[jacquic]

Hey gang,

Hey, great story to hear.

I never even thought it was going to be worth while approaching law firms since they get hassled by solicitors all the time, yet when the topic of what I did came up naturally in conversation the lawyer sold himself on my needs.

Just so I don't make a fool of myself, can I clarify? Do you mean that you think attourneys get spproached (ie, 'solicited') all the time? I ask, because we also use the term solicitors as one of the areas under 'lawyer.



Moral of the story: If you aren't even MENTIONING what you do to businesses then you are denying them your help.

Nice one

I got a job once wearing a shabby raincoat and welly boots, with a muddy dog in tow. I was so relaxed thinking they wouldn't want to hire me that I sparkled and did really well.

~ Jacqui

[Dexx]

Hi jacqui, yes I mean they get approached by sales people all the time, so I didn't think I'd even bother trying to market anything to them...learned my lesson tho, from now on I'll make sure to "casually" mention what I do to any business I'm in =)

Cheers,

~Dexx

[jacquic]

Could you not just 'casually' happen to have a book in your brief case at the time (or whever you use to carry things in)...

~ jacqui

[Dexx]

Well I don't have copies of my book yet, still waiting for my proof-copy in the mail, but once I do I'm sure I'll keep some in my trunk for just such times

Cheers,

~Dexx

[cityofangels]

Dexx, what a great story. Lawyers are a rich niche. I should know--I used to play one a few years ago. LOL. Really, I graduated from law school, knew before I even got accepted that I didn't want to practice. After I worked for one for a summer, I REALLY knew I didn't want the traditional route. Even before graduation, I already had my business setup. Been doing my own thing since the age of 10. I guess that unconventional streak hasn't rubbed off me yet!

Go after those attorneys. There's a lot of offline gold there. Go for it!

BTW, I guess next time you have to drop by a professional's office you'll be wearing nice slacks and shirt. Those meetings can pop up at any time. Always be prepared.

Keep us updated on how that works out for you. Wishing you much success!

BTW, did you buy a WSO or something for publishing your book on Amazon?

[mktmkr]

Nice one, Dexx! Thanks for sharing!

[Venturetothetop]

oh I laugh so hard when I see free merchandise. I havent paid for a pen in years!

Good stuff Dexx, and good tip your give people. If they are giving away free merchandise just ask if they are tracking it. Great opener to get in there.

[DogScout]

Now that is what I call making the most of an OP!

[Dexx]

BTW, did you buy a WSO or something for publishing your book on Amazon?

If you check in the GMS section on this forum you'll find Tanne's Amazon book which is probably the most detailed guide created so far in regards to publishing professional looking books on Amazon =)

Cheers,

~Dexx

[Dexx]

oh I laugh so hard when I see free merchandise. I havent paid for a pen in years!

Good stuff Dexx, and good tip your give people. If they are giving away free merchandise just ask if they are tracking it. Great opener to get in there.

I've actually found just the opening of "How to do you track results" can crack any business owner / representative... leaves them saying "Well, uh...uh...we uh..."

Then you just toss in something like "If you're interested, I can show you how you can track the results of all your marketing automatically so you can drop the poor performers and increase sales without any additional effort"

Cha-Ching!

~Dexx

[RoyE]

Nice story, Dexx. I think we'll be taking the published author route pretty soon. We bought Tanne's book, and very good it is!

[Roarkman]

Dexx,

Great story and very timely for myself. I'm new to this and still learning and trying to assimilate all the info - I'm a lawyer myself but don't like practicing law. SO, i thought, hey - market for other lawyers, duh. Obviously, I know a lot of lawyers but I don't have any credibility as a marketer in their eyes - I need some quick start materials if you don't mind sharing or directing me to some resources. I'd be happy to share some fees on some deals. I really feel like there is a ton of opportunity in that space - you wouldn't believe what these guys pay for marketing.

I also have another client that I just don't have an answer for in the payday loan business and check cashing. I'll start a new thread on that.

Thanks for creating this fantastic resource Dexx.

[~Shannon~]

HA! That's awesome, Dexx
I love stories like that

In a casual situation like that, the business person your dealing with isn't mentally 'on guard' and ready with a bunch of objections to your sales pitch, like they are with all the solicitors that walk in the door.

[seangreen]

I actually have a potential lawyer client.
but i am really new to this.. so i'm a little lost.
this lawyer does have a website. and he does have ppc advertising.
he gets a lot of phonecalls.. lets say 120 a week. (which you can imagine is super time-consuming)

this is where he wants me to step in.
he wants a higher conversion rate from phonecalls to paying clients.
right now he has a max of 7% conversion rate.

any suggestions?
I'm really really new to this.. any suggestions will help. thanks.

[ramprof]

There are many things you can do to help this client, but let's face facts this particular problem seems to be a bit beyond your expertise. The problem is that with so many new people entering the off-line world (buying those high priced "guru" programs) this situation is bound to come up more and more. In the end it may give everyone a bad name.

So, here is my advice (for what it's worth) - find somebody (local or maybe on here) who has some actual experience handling this type of problem. Partner with that person for this client. Yes, you'll make less money, but you'll learn a new skill. In addition, your client is more likely to respect you and come back to you in the future. I think most business owners would much rather work with a person who has the guts to say "hey this is not really my thing so I'm going to bring somebody in to help out" rather than just try it themselves and screw it up.

Not sure where you live, but here in NJ you would become the "I have a guy..." As in "I have a guy that can get that done for you"...

-Ross

I actually have a potential lawyer client.
but i am really new to this.. so i'm a little lost.
this lawyer does have a website. and he does have ppc advertising.
he gets a lot of phonecalls.. lets say 120 a week. (which you can imagine is super time-consuming)

this is where he wants me to step in.
he wants a higher conversion rate from phonecalls to paying clients.
right now he has a max of 7% conversion rate.

any suggestions?
I'm really really new to this.. any suggestions will help. thanks.

[seangreen]

this guy actually knows that i'm new...
he's letting me have the go at it..
but for minimum pay :p

anyone interested in partnering up with me?
condition is.. that i want to learn on the job...
so you have to tell me what you are doing.

[Dexx]

Two quick things:

1) What are the other 93% looking for that he feels he can not provide them and is there a way for him TO profit from what they looking for? (if he can't provide the service then possibly partnering with someone who can)

2) How is he currently generating those leads and what is the message he is sending to them that makes THEM believe that HE might be the solution to their problem? (his message is not targeted enough to the leads he WANTS)

I suggest you go through a Target Analysis Interview with him and identify the needs/wants/concerns of HIS target market so that you can take a look at his existing marketing and see if they match each other...I'm going to guess they don't....in which case this will need to be fixed ASAP (to prevent wasted time)

Cheers,

~Dexx

I actually have a potential lawyer client.
but i am really new to this.. so i'm a little lost.
this lawyer does have a website. and he does have ppc advertising.
he gets a lot of phonecalls.. lets say 120 a week. (which you can imagine is super time-consuming)

this is where he wants me to step in.
he wants a higher conversion rate from phonecalls to paying clients.
right now he has a max of 7% conversion rate.

any suggestions?
I'm really really new to this.. any suggestions will help. thanks.

[seangreen]

2 very good points. thank you. will run it by them tomorrow.

His leads are mainly coming from ppc right now.
I think what happens is - is that people shop around. They make a few phone calls before they decide who they wan to use.
I suggested to him to
a.set up a survey system and
b. a follow up system (from the phone calls they get) because some (potential) clients are interested
but they need the follow up. (i think :-) )
so this would probably be an autoresponder kind of system.

but, i have no idea how to implement this -- as of yet.

[AP]

Perhaps the moral of the story is to "dress down" when visiting these guys.

-David

Moral of the story is the lawyer had respect for Dexx because Dexx is now a published author.

It makes no difference how you're dressed. If business owners have confidence in you they will listen.

~AP

[ramprof]

One other thing to think about is who are the potential clients speaking with - the lawyer or a receptionist? What is their sales pitch? Very often businesses have the wrong people talking with prospects. Example - I am working with a private school. The admissions director deals with prospects, but she has absolutely no sales skills. So when a prospects says "it's too expensive" she does not know how to respond in order to save the sale.

Go through the sales process yourself (as if you were a prospect). Click on the ad (is it targeted to your problem and geographic area?). What is on the landing page? Is there information that a prospect would want to see (credentials, experience, etc.)? Is there a call to action - call us, e-mail us, fill out form? What happens next? How long does it take for them to respond to an e-mail or form? Call them up and see what the process is.

If you want to find somebody to partner with indicate your location (and feel free to PM me).

-Ross

2 very good points. thank you. will run it by them tomorrow.

His leads are mainly coming from ppc right now.
I think what happens is - is that people shop around. They make a few phone calls before they decide who they wan to use.
I suggested to him to
a.set up a survey system and
b. a follow up system (from the phone calls they get) because some (potential) clients are interested
but they need the follow up. (i think :-) )
so this would probably be an autoresponder kind of system.

but, i have no idea how to implement this -- as of yet.

[BigTom]

Hey Guys!

Had I discovered this post I would have responded earlier because I had a similar experience the on 5th of this month while visiting my attorney. Similar in the sense that my attorney really doesn't have a handle on marketing his business. Since I personally don't believe that my life is governed by luck (***warning*** this may offend some people but it's the life I live) I will say that this experience was appointed by God.

Here's what happened. I needed to have power of attorney drawn up so I looked through my plan's directory containing a listing of attorneys along with the services they provide, bankruptcy, real estate, divorce, etc... I chose one who provided real estate services and who was located near my house. After I called and asked for directions I realized it was the same attorney I used almost 5 years ago for another transaction. So I got to his office, greeted him with a firm hand shake and reminded him that I had used his services a few years back but told him I recalled them being on the other side of the hallway. I was just making small chit chat for the first few minutes.

Well, he asked me all the pertinent questions in order to draft my document and within a short span of time he was done. While he walked to retrieved the forms from the printer I asked him "how was business?". He responded that the real estate was slow but he's now getting a lot of bankruptcies and credit card debt cases. I asked him how was he advertising and he said, "Well, I was considering Google Adwords but at $10 per click that's out." I then told him that I believe I could help. I told him that I'm a business consultant with internet marketing experience and I could help him market his business and if he had about an hour to sit down with me to answer some questions. He then told me they have some advertising dollars set aside but they didn't have money they could waste. He admitted he had done some things recently but consider it to be a loss. "However, because I trust you I would be willing to sit down with you and talk to you", he said. I am to call his secretary to set up a time to meet with him this week.

I had convinced myself that I was going to ask for an opportunity to talk with this guy prior to getting to his office. Now I don't consider myself a salesman by any means. But there was no fear in me whatsoever. I suppose it helped knowing we were the only one in his office at the time. I was shocked that he agreed so easily to talk to me. I was even more shocked when he mentioned "Google Adwords" and "we can always do have more business".

Needless to say, this being my first appointment, it is a big confidence booster out of the blocks. Huummmm...signs of a niche to pursue perhaps??

I have to be honest here, I'm assuming that I will find his needs and potential profit leaks by using the questionnaire and that I should set up another appointment with him in a week after reviewing and researching, correct guys??

[sharp]

SeanGreen - The lawyer should be pretty unhappy with the 7% conversion rate on the phone-in calls... maybe.
Here is (IMO) vital information you need to determine to have a clue what to do to deliver better results:
a) Are they blowing the calls? or...
b) Are they having too many people call them?
One of these is the biggest issue. The other one is (IMO some more) the second biggest issue.

If they aren't already, get those calls recorded. Find out about the training they've provided their phone staff. Arrange to get it fixed if it is poor. Do what I'm going to do... type out the need and ask AP to direct you to the proper resources or companies for that job. It is vital. Maybe their phone staff is doing awesome and converting garbage calls.

The other side of the coin... are they getting 'too many' calls? If the PPC campaign is working; but the ads aren't targeted enough they are just burning cash. What if you cut their ad spend by 50%, but only reduced the amount of closed clients by 5%? If that is possible (un-optimized campaign), then you can also boost the closed client count back up (and higher) once you hack out the waste and free up the capital to spend on properly targeted PPC ads (remember that 'proper targeting' is more than just the subject / location... the 'where in the buying cycle and what is my budget' matters. If you don't have a good PPC person get one, or get reading and testing. A lot.

[seangreen]

Thanks. I'm doing a ton of reading (maybe too much---overloaded!!)
but its hard for me to do anything when I feel I don't know what I am really supposed to be doing -
as mentioned before there are lots of 'whats' and little 'hows' being discussed.

but, my thought about this lawyer is that he has to capture the potential clients email and follow up.
I think that would help convert the serious inquiries into clients. (he agreed - but how to implement that??)